Recycling, PAYT, and Tipping Fees

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Postby Mark Fitzgerald » Thu Nov 20, 2003 4:17 pm

You're too funny Norman!!! :D :D :D
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Postby Dennis King » Thu Nov 20, 2003 7:40 pm

Norm,

Are you implying we won't have the same level of recycling if we don't have PAYT?

All these years, people have done this without being forced to do it.

I particularly object to the compulsitory nature of PAYT.

We have enough government interference in our lives.

Dennis
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Postby Nat Fairbanks » Thu Nov 20, 2003 8:10 pm

Dennis King wrote:I particularly object to the compulsitory nature of PAYT.

What could possibly be compulsory about PAYT? You pay for exactly what you throw away. You are given the opportunity to reduce the amount of trash you throw away by recycling material for free. How is that compulsory? I've participated in compulsory recycling programs before, but only in places without PAYT. There they had a "trash cop" that handed out $50 fines if your garbage contained recyclable materials. That is compulsory recycling. PAYT is not.

Recycling allows the town to be paid for material rather than paying to have it removed. If you have one ton of recyclable material you can either pay approx $65 to throw it away or have someone pay you $10 (a guess) so they can take it away. Recycling isn't a big money making proposition, but even if they just take it away for free the town will save $65 for every ton of material that is recycled rather than thrown away.

-Nat
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Postby Mark Fitzgerald » Fri Nov 21, 2003 8:09 am

Nat,

You make perfect sense.
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Postby Chuck Mower » Fri Nov 21, 2003 9:58 am

Mark,
I think we should subscribe to the new SW program proposed and supported by so many. It is called the Deny Every Noteworthy Notion In Sight program.
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Postby RBarnes » Fri Nov 21, 2003 10:26 am

Since this thread is more on topic I will address DA’s comment here.

Devils Advocate wrote:While im at it, BOS do the right thing and do not initiate pay t (sorry for going off topic) to placate the CS crew. They are the definition of special interest.


DA, it has been clearly explain and even the town manager and at least 4 of the current BOS agree the ONLY fair way to implement the TS will be PAYT.

I would love to hear you explain a detailed explanation of WHY you feel PAYT would be the wrong thing?

Further more, if the cost of the TS is passed on to taxes the town would be catering to the haulers and likewise they would be the definition of a special interest group.
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Postby Muriel Lortie » Fri Nov 21, 2003 1:41 pm

Rick,
The town asked for CS bids from WM, BFI, local haulers etc.. The local haulers never put in a bid because they stated they could not get bonded and felt it was out of their league. :roll:
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Postby Norman Phillips » Fri Nov 21, 2003 2:07 pm

Dennis King wrote:Norm,

Are you implying we won't have the same level of recycling if we don't have PAYT?
Absolutely, sir. This has been demonstrated in many municipalitiesl

Without PAYT the only incentive to recycle is altruism. With PAYT there is a financial incentive. Which do you think plays best in most communities?
All these years, people have done this without being forced to do it.

Yes, but it was probably only about one third of the community, the self-haulers.

I particularly object to the compulsitory nature of PAYT.
I am not sure what "compulsitory" means, I think you mean compulsory. There is nothing compulsory about PAYT, Dennis. If you do not want to recycle and reduce your waste stream, you simply buy enough bags to take all of your trash.
Sincerely, Norm Phillips
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Postby Devils Advocate » Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:47 pm

DA, it has been clearly explain and even the town manager and at least 4 of the current BOS agree the ONLY fair way to implement the TS will be PAYT.

I would love to hear you explain a detailed explanation of WHY you feel PAYT would be the wrong thing?

I believe I have already stated that in earlier threads. I know your motivation and it has nothing to due with equity. But for you, I will say it once more. The town should fund this on the tax rate because I feel it is a service the town should offer for the outrageous amount of taxes that I pay to live here. The least they can do is give me a little bang for my buck and take a very small portion of this and dispose of the citizens of Merrimacks trash. Im tired about hearing about on the backs of CS, use the TS and stop your whining. If you want the convienence of pickup up.
pay for it. Iv'e repeated this a million times. The people who voted for TS did not go into that booth thinking they were voteing for payt. If the BOS trys to cater to your special interst group once more, they are just fueling the fire all over again. I will not respond to you anymore RB, my feelings about this are written all over these forums old and new. You could care less about payt, fairness, safety etc. it is all about doing anything and everthing to get rid of the TS in the future and off your road. But keep on plugging, we need a new MF for the next round of votes.
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Postby Mark Fitzgerald » Fri Nov 21, 2003 4:03 pm

Hey DA (aka "the coward"), anytime "pal", anytime.

How'd Frugal Frannie do in the last election?

:P :P
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Postby Mark Fitzgerald » Fri Nov 21, 2003 4:24 pm

You know things are gettin' a little scary for trannies when they drag "DA" out of mothballs.

This whole tipping fee thing sure has'em rattled. I wonder why?
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Postby RBarnes » Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:48 pm

I would love to hear you explain a detailed explanation of WHY you feel PAYT would be the wrong thing?


Devils Advocate wrote:I believe I have already stated that in earlier threads.


Sorry, I must have missed it.

Devils Advocate wrote:I know your motivation and it has nothing to due with equity.


I make any bias I have well known... can you say the same?

The town should fund this on the tax rate because I feel it is a service the town should offer for the outrageous amount of taxes that I pay to live here.[/quote]

Then why INCREASE taxes even more by putting this on the taxes as well? Putting on tipping or PAYT would result in FEWER taxes.

Devils Advocate wrote:The least they can do is give me a little bang for my buck and take a very small portion of this and dispose of the citizens of Merrimacks trash.


That would be curbside... the town voted against that. Now you have to PAY for the inconvenience of hauling your own trash or pay even more to hire someone. And depending on the method of funding the station you may find yourself paying to keep the costs of local businesses down. I for one do not agree with corporate welfare.

Devils Advocate wrote:The people who voted for TS did not go into that booth thinking they were voteing for payt.


If you look at town meetings and committee meetings they ALL said for a TS to work the town had to go PAYT. Alternatives were NEVER discussed so to say otherwise is out right WRONG.

Devils Advocate wrote:If the BOS trys to cater to your special interst group once more, they are just fueling the fire all over again.


Trust me DA, I would MUCH rather see this put 100% into taxes. If as you say my goal is to get this TS to crash and burn I couldn't think of a better way to do it then to put it 100% into taxes.

Devils Advocate wrote:I will not respond to you anymore RB, my feelings about this are written all over these forums old and new.


Dennis, LT and now you... oh what am I going to do. Don't worry DA, I will continue to point out the faults in your arguments even if you fail to acknowledge anything I post.

Devils Advocate wrote:You could care less about payt, fairness, safety etc. it is all about doing anything and everthing to get rid of the TS in the future and off your road.


I'm sad you feel that way... Safety is my TOP concern. To say otherwise is wrong.

Devils Advocate wrote:But keep on plugging, we need a new MF for the next round of votes.


This is even sadder that you feel this town is full of such hate filled people that they ignore issues and just vote because of feelings of dislike they have towards people. Your vision of Merrimack doesn't sound at all like a nice place to live and although maybe the people you hang around with are vial people who do vote out of hate I would have to argue they are a minority.
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Postby Norman Phillips » Fri Nov 21, 2003 7:24 pm

The town should fund this on the tax rate because I feel it is a service the town should offer for the outrageous amount of taxes that I pay to live here. The least they can do is give me a little bang for my buck and take a very small portion of this and dispose of the citizens of Merrimacks trash. ----.


DA, I have often read your postings, looking for any evidence that you understand beans about town finances. Unfortunately, I have never seen any smell of such evidence.

Do you even have an idea of what it will cost to export Merrimack's trash?
( Answer--in the vicinity of 2 million plus ) . This is not a small portion, it is about TEN PERCENT OF THE TOWN BUDGET!!!.
With about 10,000 households, this averages out to roughly $200 per household.
This is probably a good fraction of the jump in your tax bill.

THEREFORE THERE IS NO REASON IN KINGDOM COME WHY YOU HAVE ANY JUSTIFICATION FOR STATING THAT YOU SHOULD GET IT AS A FREE BENNIE ON YOUR TAX BILL.
Sincerely, Norm Phillips
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Postby uscitizen03054 » Fri Nov 21, 2003 8:01 pm

Norm, you are confusing me! The following statement is the culprit.

THEREFORE THERE IS NO REASON IN KINGDOM COME WHY YOU HAVE ANY JUSTIFICATION FOR STATING THAT YOU SHOULD GET IT AS A FREE BENNIE ON YOUR TAX BILL.


If you pay for SW disposal in your tax bill how is it free?
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Postby Devils Advocate » Fri Nov 21, 2003 8:01 pm

Just using your trumped up figures from way back when Norm. Your figures stated minimal difference in the cost between curbside and a transfer station. I don't remember whether it was on the old forum or the new and certainly don't want to take the time to find them again. I do know at the time I responded to those figures saying that it basically comes down to a matter of choice because the figures of yours were so close.

DA, I have often read your postings, looking for any evidence that you understand beans about town finances. Unfortunately, I have never seen any smell of such evidence.

Norm, I have often read your postings, looking for any evidence that you understand beans about anything, let alone town finances. Unfortunatly, I have never seen any smell of such evidence.
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