Really amazing..

Moderator: The Merrimack Volunteer Moderators

Really amazing..

Postby RayWhipple » Fri Mar 18, 2011 11:00 am

Recently I went to the TS and threw my trash and looked over the side and saw a bunch of card board, newspaper, plastic bottles, and a cardboard box filled with empty bear cans. It amazes me that people can't or refuse to recycle as a form of protest. As I looked at the stuff and think back to all the people pissed off about the PAYT I shake my head. I am going to bring my camera next time and start posting pics just to show what I see.
"Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves. " ~President Ronald Reagan.

http://www.newt.org/
User avatar
RayWhipple
 
Posts: 236
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:27 am
Location: Merrimack NH

Re: Really amazing..

Postby Dennis King » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:08 pm

Wow what a great use of your time Ray! I am sure you will get a better pic down on the trash floor. Better bring Tim and the rest of the TC along, after all, "policing" the trash is such an important part of your lives!

Can't wait to see all the "violations" Yes indeed, too busy to run for TC but have plenty of time to attack the people at the TS, makes all the sense in the world to me!

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
User avatar
Dennis King
 
Posts: 2032
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 10:37 am

Re: Really amazing..

Postby RD » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:51 pm

Dennis King wrote:
Yes indeed, too busy to run for TC but have plenty of time to attack the people



Oh the irony... :lol:
"If you think teachers are your enemy, you should probably reassess who you think your friends are." - Chris Larson
RD
 
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:49 pm

Re: Really amazing..

Postby joeteacher73 » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:54 pm

My guess is that recycling by "former" users of the transfer station will drop. Getting the bags will be a hassle so I will move to pick-up. I have yet to find anyone who will pick up my trash and accept single stream recyclables. Given this, I will stop recycling, I don't want to, and dispose of everything into the waste stream.
joeteacher73
 
Posts: 37
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:05 am

Re: Really amazing..

Postby Dennis King » Fri Mar 18, 2011 1:59 pm

joeteacher73 wrote:My guess is that recycling by "former" users of the transfer station will drop. Getting the bags will be a hassle so I will move to pick-up. I have yet to find anyone who will pick up my trash and accept single stream recyclables. Given this, I will stop recycling, I don't want to, and dispose of everything into the waste stream.


Hold out hope Joe, the other shoe has yet to drop, the real plan of the TC is to have town wide curbside with once again, MANDATORY PAYT.

That is coming next year so for all of you who think it is OK to slam the self haulers because it doesn't effect you, the other shoe is coming, and you will soon feel the weight of those boots on you too!

What was it they said,,, First they came for......
User avatar
Dennis King
 
Posts: 2032
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2003 10:37 am

Re: Really amazing..

Postby RayWhipple » Fri Mar 18, 2011 2:20 pm

Dennis King wrote:Wow what a great use of your time Ray! I am sure you will get a better pic down on the trash floor. Better bring Tim and the rest of the TC along, after all, "policing" the trash is such an important part of your lives!

Can't wait to see all the "violations" Yes indeed, too busy to run for TC but have plenty of time to attack the people at the TS, makes all the sense in the world to me!

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:


You are truly amazing Dennis. To compare that I don't have time to run for town council but I have time to "police" the transfer station? You are such an A**. You act like I will be standing there popping pictures all day. You and those like you are what's wrong with our political system which is run by the far left and far right when the rest of us, (70%) are moderates and get insulted by the likes of you and those like you and I am tired of it and so is a lot of REAL Americans which is why the # of people voting is not what it should be is because people are sick of the crap, sick of the one sided and sick of the crooks on both sides of the spectrum. All i did was point out the lack of recycling in an effort to point out that if there was MORE recycling then just maybe the idea of PAYT would not be needed. But as usual you and your time turn it into some conspiracy to end life as we know it. Get a clue Dennis, if that's at all possible. I am done holding back...I will speak my mind and like many others expose you for what you and others like you really are. END OF RANT...
"Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves. " ~President Ronald Reagan.

http://www.newt.org/
User avatar
RayWhipple
 
Posts: 236
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:27 am
Location: Merrimack NH

Re: Really amazing..

Postby RBarnes » Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:08 pm

Dennis King wrote:Wow what a great use of your time Ray! I am sure you will get a better pic down on the trash floor. Better bring Tim and the rest of the TC along, after all, "policing" the trash is such an important part of your lives!

Can't wait to see all the "violations" Yes indeed, too busy to run for TC but have plenty of time to attack the people at the TS, makes all the sense in the world to me!


Dennis, I didn't take Rays comment to be an attack in the least.

For every bit of trash tossed into that station we pay for it on our property taxes. Well over $900k a year in tipping fees and it's going to most likely double in 2012. And we GET money for every bit of trash tossed into the recycling building. That's money that LOWERS our taxes.

Why is it that you seem to have a problem spending on everything except trash?

Your against PAYT, fine... we get that. But what Ray is talking about is recycling vs tossing into the trash. About spending taxes vs getting taxes lowered. Or are you for wasting tax dollars as long as it's on the things you want?
$DO || ! $DO ; try
try: command not found
User avatar
RBarnes
 
Posts: 6852
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2003 1:21 pm
Location: Merrimack

Re: Really amazing..

Postby John Harrahy » Sun Mar 27, 2011 3:05 pm

I believe that what Ray has done (look to see how much of what's tossed into the TS is actually recyclable) is exactly what needs to be done. Belittling his efforts is not helpful in the least.

The town's case for PAYT is based on a 50% reduction in trash going into the TS, from 9,000 tons to 4,500. Their presentation implies (but is careful not to state explicitly) these 4,500 tons will now be recycled. Certainly even with PAYT, at least a little recyclable trash is going to get mixed in with the non-recyclable, so the town's case assumes more than half the trash now going into the TC is actually recyclable, if people would only take the time and effort to separate out the recyclables and dump them at the RC.

While Ray's observations tend to support this at least to some degree, I have to say that's not my experience at all. I go to the RC & TS every week, and I see very few bypassing the RC to go straight to the TS. Almost everyone pulls into the RC and dumps quite a bit of stuff. And when I go to the TS, I don't make a point of studying what others throw, but I think I'd notice if there were a lot of recyclable stuff tossed.

So in my opinion, the town's figures appear to be grossly inflated, to make the financial case for PAYT.

I've studied their 12 page viewgraph presentation, and nowhere do I see what the basis is for any of the numbers they toss around.

Besides some of their assumptions being highly questionable (in my opinion), the cost numbers they present will actually result in a substantial cost increase to almost all TS users. The tax reduction promised ($656,146 if you go by the "Financial Overview - PAYT" slide, $641,063 if you go by the original wording of the petitioned Article 8) amounts to 22 cents per thousand on the tax rate. The cost of the bags is estimated at $130 per household per year. So unless your property is asessed at more than $590,000, you will spend more for bags than you save in taxes.

So what it comes down to, as has been pointed out by other people, PAYT is a bald attempt by the people who now pay to have their trash picked up to have the TS users subsidize their trash costs. It really has little to nothing to do with recycling at all.

Certainly we all need to make every effort to recycle everything we can - the town sells the recyclables, it pays to have non-recyclables hauled away, and we all save on the tax rate. But PAYT is not the way to go. In my opinion.

But I could be wrong. So what really needs to be done is for someone to collect some facts, not opinions or assumptions based on very little hard data.

So please, everyone, when you go to the dump, take note of how many cars bypass the RC and go straight to the TS, and when you're at the TS, look at what the people beside you are tossing. And report it here. So maybe by April 12 we'll have a little data to help the voters make an informed choice.
John Harrahy
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2011 1:54 pm

Re: Really amazing..

Postby RayWhipple » Mon Mar 28, 2011 5:09 am

John Harrahy wrote:I believe that what Ray has done (look to see how much of what's tossed into the TS is actually recyclable) is exactly what needs to be done. Belittling his efforts is not helpful in the least.

The town's case for PAYT is based on a 50% reduction in trash going into the TS, from 9,000 tons to 4,500. Their presentation implies (but is careful not to state explicitly) these 4,500 tons will now be recycled. Certainly even with PAYT, at least a little recyclable trash is going to get mixed in with the non-recyclable, so the town's case assumes more than half the trash now going into the TC is actually recyclable, if people would only take the time and effort to separate out the recyclables and dump them at the RC.

While Ray's observations tend to support this at least to some degree, I have to say that's not my experience at all. I go to the RC & TS every week, and I see very few bypassing the RC to go straight to the TS. Almost everyone pulls into the RC and dumps quite a bit of stuff. And when I go to the TS, I don't make a point of studying what others throw, but I think I'd notice if there were a lot of recyclable stuff tossed.

So in my opinion, the town's figures appear to be grossly inflated, to make the financial case for PAYT.

I've studied their 12 page viewgraph presentation, and nowhere do I see what the basis is for any of the numbers they toss around.

Besides some of their assumptions being highly questionable (in my opinion), the cost numbers they present will actually result in a substantial cost increase to almost all TS users. The tax reduction promised ($656,146 if you go by the "Financial Overview - PAYT" slide, $641,063 if you go by the original wording of the petitioned Article 8) amounts to 22 cents per thousand on the tax rate. The cost of the bags is estimated at $130 per household per year. So unless your property is asessed at more than $590,000, you will spend more for bags than you save in taxes.

So what it comes down to, as has been pointed out by other people, PAYT is a bald attempt by the people who now pay to have their trash picked up to have the TS users subsidize their trash costs. It really has little to nothing to do with recycling at all.

Certainly we all need to make every effort to recycle everything we can - the town sells the recyclables, it pays to have non-recyclables hauled away, and we all save on the tax rate. But PAYT is not the way to go. In my opinion.

But I could be wrong. So what really needs to be done is for someone to collect some facts, not opinions or assumptions based on very little hard data.

So please, everyone, when you go to the dump, take note of how many cars bypass the RC and go straight to the TS, and when you're at the TS, look at what the people beside you are tossing. And report it here. So maybe by April 12 we'll have a little data to help the voters make an informed choice.


first I don't stand around and watch people toss their trash. I just happen to look over the wall and see all that should have been recycled and that's just one day and for my brief time there. My main point is if we recycled more of what we were should be, just maybe the PAYT would not even be an idea. But the facts are there, just look over the wall.
"Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves. " ~President Ronald Reagan.

http://www.newt.org/
User avatar
RayWhipple
 
Posts: 236
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:27 am
Location: Merrimack NH

Re: Really amazing..

Postby ggkrupp » Mon Mar 28, 2011 6:51 am

John Harrahy wrote:So in my opinion, the town's figures appear to be grossly inflated, to make the financial case for PAYT.

I've studied their 12 page viewgraph presentation, and nowhere do I see what the basis is for any of the numbers they toss around.



John,

I have made this point in other threads an I think you are right on target. The shame of it is that even after two years of hotly debating this topic, neither the Director of Public Works or the Solid Waste manager have collected data on a monthly basis. The lack of data only encourages folks on all sides of this debate to make up the stats, projections and benefits as they go. At a minimum, (1) tonnage tipped, (2) tipping fees paid, (3) tonnage recycled and (4) recycling revenue generated statistics should be collected on a monthly basis (and weekly would probably be better).
Gary G. Krupp

America is a Constitutional Republic, not a Democracy (thankfully) :-)
User avatar
ggkrupp
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2011 5:41 pm
Location: Ministerial Dr

Re: Really amazing..

Postby RBarnes » Mon Mar 28, 2011 9:41 am

John Harrahy wrote:The town's case for PAYT is based on a 50% reduction in trash going into the TS, from 9,000 tons to 4,500. Their presentation implies (but is careful not to state explicitly) these 4,500 tons will now be recycled.


I believe the town will see at least a 50% reduction but I do agree with you that it wouldn't result in an increase in recycling at the station. Personally as soon as it's no longer financially favorable for me to dump my trash at the transfer station (ie other tax payers stop paying for it) then I would most likely turn around and hire one of the local haulers in town. I'm sure others would as well. When you actually have to pay to haul your own trash instead of having other tax payers subsidize the costs, and pay gas on top of it you realize it's a heck of a lot easier to have someone pick it up at the end of your driveway.

That said, I think a lot of what goes into the pit are items people aren't aware can be recycled. The DPW did a video a few weeks back where they took a random trash bag off the floor of the station. It weighed in at around 10 pounds. The split it up and divided everything into different categories. When all was said and done only around 2 pounds of it could not be recycled.
Given this, I think more people need to be educated as far as what can be recycled. If it were to hold true to all other bags of trash tossed in that even 60% of what's tossed away could be recycled would you feel comfortable paying the costs of someone who chooses to be wasteful?
$DO || ! $DO ; try
try: command not found
User avatar
RBarnes
 
Posts: 6852
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2003 1:21 pm
Location: Merrimack


Return to Solid Waste, Landfill & Recycling

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

cron