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Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:52 pm
by platypusman
There are benefits and costs and even health issues with almost all energy sources.


Wind whips up health fears
Hundreds of giant turbines in the Oregon desert will bring power, but residents nearby raise concerns about health effects and an end to their quiet way of lifeSunday, August 10, 2008 RICHARD COCKLE

The Oregonian Staff
BOARDMAN -- Sherry Eaton pulled into the driveway of her rural, high-desert home to see one of several giant wind turbines being assembled a half-mile away.

"I started to cry," Eaton, 57, recalled of her first sight of the Willow Creek Wind Project in late July. "They're going to be hanging over the back of our house, and now there's the medical thing."

"The medical thing" is new research suggesting that living close to wind turbines, as Eaton and her 60-year old husband, Mike, soon will be doing, can cause sleep disorders, difficulty with equilibrium, headaches, childhood "night terrors" and other health problems.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:01 pm
by Tom Williams
platypusman wrote:There are benefits and costs and even health issues with almost all energy sources.


Wind whips up health fears
Hundreds of giant turbines in the Oregon desert will bring power, but residents nearby raise concerns about health effects and an end to their quiet way of lifeSunday, August 10, 2008 RICHARD COCKLE

The Oregonian Staff
BOARDMAN -- Sherry Eaton pulled into the driveway of her rural, high-desert home to see one of several giant wind turbines being assembled a half-mile away.

"I started to cry," Eaton, 57, recalled of her first sight of the Willow Creek Wind Project in late July. "They're going to be hanging over the back of our house, and now there's the medical thing."

"The medical thing" is new research suggesting that living close to wind turbines, as Eaton and her 60-year old husband, Mike, soon will be doing, can cause sleep disorders, difficulty with equilibrium, headaches, childhood "night terrors" and other health problems.


Poppycock!

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:06 pm
by andysinnh
Next thing you know, folks will be against solar power because of the cancer-causing characteristics of the sun. :lol:

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:12 pm
by platypusman
Maybe so, but with these types of claims, coupled with our litigious society, situations like this will increase the cost to deploy this type of technology. Already, wind farms face the NIMBY from the likes of Teddy Kennedy.

There is no quick fix to our current energy problems so we need to drill for oil while new sources can be put into place.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:16 pm
by TCF
What is it with the libs and their hate for oil. Its a natural resource taken out of the ground, Yes we should research alternitive energy, but the truth is, it is not even feasable for the near future and many years to come. Probably in most of our lifetimes.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:32 pm
by Michael Thompson
TCF wrote:What is it with the libs and their hate for oil. Its a natural resource taken out of the ground, Yes we should research alternitive energy, but the truth is, it is not even feasable for the near future and many years to come. Probably in most of our lifetimes.


Not feasible? We have been using hydro for how long?

I don't think it is the only solution nor is it the best solution.

So TCF, if anyone doesn't agree with you are they a lib? Do they have a mental disorder?

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:44 pm
by TCF
Michael Thompson wrote:
TCF wrote:What is it with the libs and their hate for oil. Its a natural resource taken out of the ground, Yes we should research alternitive energy, but the truth is, it is not even feasable for the near future and many years to come. Probably in most of our lifetimes.


Not feasible? We have been using hydro for how long?

I don't think it is the only solution nor is it the best solution.

So TCF, if anyone doesn't agree with you are they a lib? Do they have a mental disorder?


Again, what is your hate for oil? Whats not feasible, drilling for oil. I to say its not the only solution, we should explore each and every option available, which we have been doing for years and will continue to do so. Until that time, there is enough oil to last 1000 yrs. I think by then someone will figure it out. Do you have any idea what oil is used for other than to fuel our automobiles? The list is a mile long. Nope I have conservatives I don't agree with too. IE John McCain on most issues.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:17 pm
by andysinnh
I saw an interview with the CEO of ExxonMobil the other day, and when asked if he supported McCain's "Drill now, drill often, drill everywhere" approach - he said that it's a balance of some additional drilling, but also taking to heart Picken's approach to alternative methods of energy, as well as the fact that the concept of "energy independence" is not attainable, since even if we did pump a lot more oil, we'd likely be exporting it to those who need to be competitive in the global market. He wasn't completely convinced that such an action would greatly reduce the cost of oil, and therefore gas.

I believe this was part of an ABC interview - but you'd figure an oil guy would be McCain's best friend - but it was interesting to see that his belief is that reality is somewhere in between McCain and Obama's positions. I'm sure he'd support McCain only due to the windfall profit scenario Obama is chucking around - but he was very interesting to listen to.

Oil alone is not the answer, TCF - but perhaps you're a stockholder in Exxonmobil for your strong push towards that as the leading, and forsaking all other, methods of moving forward...

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:29 pm
by Michael Thompson
TCF wrote:Again, what is your hate for oil? Whats not feasible, drilling for oil. I to say its not the only solution, we should explore each and every option available, which we have been doing for years and will continue to do so. Until that time, there is enough oil to last 1000 yrs. I think by then someone will figure it out. Do you have any idea what oil is used for other than to fuel our automobiles? The list is a mile long. Nope I have conservatives I don't agree with too. IE John McCain on most issues.


Were did I state anywhere that I hate oil?

Let's see I only use products created by oil everyday to make my life easier and to assist with my financial success.

As for there being alternatives, there are many feasible solutions that would assist in the consumption of oil and the polution of the air.

I don't hate oil, just want cleaner solutions to some of our consumption of energy.

One of my goals is to cut my energy intake by over 75% by 2010 for my household. My research shows about an 8K investment will allow for this. It would take me less then 5 years for the ROI on the investment, not to mention increase the value of my home. I just wish it wasn't so feasible!

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 5:18 am
by Michael Pelletier
andysinnh wrote:I saw an interview with the CEO of ExxonMobil the other day, and when asked if he supported McCain's "Drill now, drill often, drill everywhere" approach - he said that it's a balance of some additional drilling, but also taking to heart Picken's approach to alternative methods of energy, as well as the fact that the concept of "energy independence" is not attainable, since even if we did pump a lot more oil, we'd likely be exporting it to those who need to be competitive in the global market.


http://banking.about.com/od/securityand ... obbery.htm
Remember that the bank robber is trying to avoid getting caught, and he probably knows what you’re looking for. Therefore, do not stare at a bank robber. In fact, it’s best not to attract any attention to yourself. Simply follow instructions so that the robber can get out of there as soon as possible. Law enforcement will pursue the robber. Agitating a bank robber can result in harm to yourself and/or others.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_q ... i_n9172694
Eavenson says contain your emotions, stay alert, listen carefully to the robber's instructions and follow them closely. "Do not make negative statements to the robber," says Eavenson, who, in the video, appears in a suit. Idealized lawman fading from mind, being replaced by bank industry consultant...


Were you aware that Nancy Pelosi invested $50-$100,000 in the IPO of Pickens' CNLE Corporation, which is looking to cash in on government handouts?
Image
From the New York Post:
Naturally, the Pickens Big Wind plan is proudly endorsed by Pelosi's friends at the Sierra Club. Through another company, Mesa Power, Pickens has committed upward of $12 billion in wind farms on the Texas panhandle. CLNE and Mesa Power are separate entities, but what benefits one piece of the Pickens puzzle benefits them all. The wind venture, as Pickens himself admits, depends on permanent federal subsidies.

Pickens is banking on 'em. And Pelosi is banking on him. She bought between $50,000 and $100,000 worth of stock in Pickens' CLNE Corp. in May 2007 on the day of the initial public offering:

"She, and other investors, stand to gain a substantial return on their investment if gasoline prices stay high, and municipal, state and even the federal governments start using natural gas as their primary fuel source," reported dontgomovement.com.

CLNE also happens to be the sponsor of Proposition 10, a ballot initiative in Pelosi's home state of California to dole out $10 billion in state and federal funds for renewable-energy incentives - namely, natural gas and wind.

Follow the money. Or, to put it in economist's terms, as energy analyst Kenneth Medlock III did in The Dallas Morning News about the Pickens multibillion-dollar wind-farm investment: "A lot of what he's trying to do is add value to a stranded asset . . . he's obviously got millions of dollars on the line."

And so, potentially, does Pelosi - all the while wagging her finger at the financial motivation of others.

When leftists talk about "investment in alternative energy," remember that they're talking about investing YOUR money, against your will, in THEIR companies. Think about that the next time you fill up your gas tank.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 6:25 am
by TCF
As for there being alternatives, there are many feasible solutions that would assist in the consumption of oil and the polution of the air.

What are these feasable alternitives you mention? There are none, that are feasable at this time.
As far as planning to cut my energy consumption, Why would I want to do that? There is plenty of energy, only those who refuse to drill for it.

But I assume that you being so energy conscious that you unplug you pc everynight, phone charger tv, Inflate your tires everyday. Sorry but the absurdity of the liberal mindset is a mental disorder. Did you give up the SUV yet? If so why?
You libs want us all living back in the 1800's when there is absolutly no reason to go backwards. And of course I am sure you belive in the biggest hoax of all, global warming. Another BS scheme to pick your pockets and go green.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:00 am
by Ken Coleman
When leftists talk about "investment in alternative energy," remember that they're talking about investing YOUR money, against your will, in THEIR companies. Think about that the next time you fill up your gas tank.


OK if the above is true then it would be also true to say;

When rightists talk about "tax breaks for oil companies," remember that they're talking about investing YOUR money, against your will, in THEIR companies. Think about that the next time you fill up your gas tank.

Ken Coleman

Someone who does think we should open up more areas for drilling, but is scared to death that is the ONLY thing we will do and that our overall dependence on thug countries will continue to grow.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:05 am
by Ken Coleman
quote]What are these feasable alternitives you mention? There are none, that are feasable at this time. [/quote]

[Just to mention one feasible alterative

If France can TODAY generate most of its electricity from Nuclear, then why can’t we? The amount of time to build nuclear power plants is about the same as new drilling for oil (Both are estimated to be 10 to 20 years).
And before someone says we do not use that much oil to generate electricity, we DO use a lot of oil to heat our homes. If electricity because cheap again, many, many people would convert.

Ken Coleman

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:09 am
by platypusman
Ken Coleman wrote:
When leftists talk about "investment in alternative energy," remember that they're talking about investing YOUR money, against your will, in THEIR companies. Think about that the next time you fill up your gas tank.


OK if the above is true then it would be also true to say;

When rightists talk about "tax breaks for oil companies," remember that they're talking about investing YOUR money, against your will, in THEIR companies. Think about that the next time you fill up your gas tank.

Ken Coleman

Someone who does think we should open up more areas for drilling, but is scared to death that is the ONLY thing we will do and that our overall dependence on thug countries will continue to grow.


Ken you raise a good point but I believe you are dismissing the impact free markets will have. The ultimate winners in our energy portfolio will be those that offer the best ROI. As we have seen recently, oil is now becoming less attractive and alternatives are finally seeing their potential realized. This is why we need to not interfere too much with market forces as it will distort investments leading to unrealistic and unhealthy situations.

Re: Windpower

PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:21 am
by Ken Coleman
Ken Coleman
What you dismiss is that Free Markets ruling with RIO may not always be best for our national interest.

Let’s take what happened after the last price run up years ago.

Oil got cheap and as a Free Market we became much more dependent on oil from rouge nations.

Let’s just say oil goes back to under $50 a barrel. Not only would all the market forces around alternatives stop, but so would much of the drilling that you want to have happen in the US. (New US oil in general is expensive to get at and requires more costly refining than much of the oil in the Middle East).

The question is if oil temporary gets cheap again and we start increasing our use of oil even further, are you willing to give up on our nation security interest in other to have unrestricted Free Market forces determine our foreign policy?

Ken Coleman

BTW Tax breaks for oil compaies to drill in the US are NOT free market forces at work!